Fujifilm is planning to compete on the full frame market; new X-E2 firmware is coming soon; company wins 5 iF awards

Fuji-logo
Dpreview published their CP+ interviews with Toshihisa Iida from Fujifilm. Here are the key points:

  • Mirrorless market in Japan is 40%, in Asia is 25%, in the US and Europe is 10% (Nikon said the same thing during their interview).
  • Fuji sells more high-end cameras that bring more profit, especially in the US.
  • New X-E2 firmware is coming soon - it will improve the refresh rate of the EVF and will add interval shooting function.
  • For now the 16MP sensor is the best combination of resolution and signal to noise ratio.
  • Fuji is planning to compete on the full frame market.

Fujifilm-wins-2014-iF-product-design-awards
Today Fujifilm announced that the company won five iF product design awards for the Fujifilm X-M1, XQ1, X100S, X20 and Instax Mini 90 Neo Classic cameras.

This entry was posted in Fuji and tagged , . Bookmark the permalink. Both comments and trackbacks are currently closed.
  • RacoonRoger

    Will X-Trans sensors get bigger, in the future?
    At the moment we’re focusing on the APS-C format but in the longer term, after we’ve completed our lens lineup… I can’t deny the possibility.

    Read the quote again. It doesn’t mean Fuji is going FF at all. He only says that they will think about it when their APS-C line-up is complete. That might take a while.

    • alreadyupsidedown

      Shhhhhhhh, don’t dull the sensationalism! I was all excited!

      It’s still interesting news though, as, if I recall correctly, a Fuji spokesperson was on record as having said that Fuji didn’t plan to pursue full frame for the foreseeable future.

    • burnitwithacid

      Agreed. I think this got lost in translation. He’s talking about competing with FF using their current crop sensors and building the cameras around that.

    • Yeah, I was about to say that.

      Actually it’s not the first time that PhotoRumors’ summary opens up for misinterpretation.

    • cppguy16

      Other than Leica, Sony is the only company that makes FF mirrorless cameras. And they’re in a little bit of a trouble for not announcing any crop sensor lenses and an NEX-7 replacement. It is very difficult to concentrate on 3 different lens lines at the same time. I think Fuji wants to complete their crop sensor set first. This way they keep existing users happy, and when the time comes for full-frame, they can sell yet another set of lenses for the hard-core customers who must always have the latest and greatest.

      • Sky

        Leica got a rangefinder, not mirrorless, and they don’t compete in mirrorless market either – they specifically said that they don’t want to.

  • saywhatuwill

    I’m game for an updated X100s that has a full frame sensor.

    • sperdynamite

      If they can do it for a good price, maybe $1,700-$2,000 dollars, or even less, that could be many people’s last digital camera (until the battery dies anyway).

      • lord eels

        no WAY will it be that cheap. expect 3k minimum.

        • sperdynamite

          Nikon can barely sell a $2,800 dollar Df to westerners. The A7 is $1,700 plus the cost of good AF Zeiss glass. Notice that the X-T1 is cheaper than the X-Pro1 was when it was newly announced. They had to learn what these things can sell for. I’d expect $2-2.5K for the body. Lenses in line with that Sony is selling their Zeiss glass for.

          • lord eels

            sony and nikon have scale Fuji has no business of even dreaming about. scale = price, especially in this field. look at the flagships do you really think they are 2x as good overall against d800/5d3? yes they have must-have features for some, but the price is due to small demand scale.

          • sperdynamite

            Just think in two years though, FF equipment and the sensors themselves will be that much cheaper from everybody. Today, maybe they could get 3k, but no way in 2-3 years.

    • Mabasa

      and FF watercolor artifacts?

      • Andrzej Dworaczek

        Watercolor artifacts? – Jpeg – yes, I agree, but they do have RAWs to play with. If you like watercolor artifacts, you may use jpegs.

        • cocerell

          Watercolor artifacts are in Raw’s … do you know that xtrans sensor raw’s has the Nr always on in order to been correctly demosaicized?

          • mikeswitz

            Do you look at pictures or pixels? The image quality of the X-trans not good enough for you?

  • Harold GLIT

    Yes i Think the title is quite misleading. I am quite certain that we won t see a X with a 35mm sensor for at least 2014 and 2015

  • Aaron

    “Fuji is planning to compete on the full frame market”

    That may just mean fuji thinks its current APS-C cameras are good enough to compete with full frame cameras for sales…..

    • Here is the exact text:

      Do you you want to compete against professional full-frame cameras?

      Inevitably yes, we have to compete against full-frame. The professional market is very segmented, and for example for sports photography I think the X-T1 is already competitive. So yes, I’d like to challenge full-frame.

      • david_

        “Inevitably yes, we have to compete against full-frame.”

        All he’s saying is that their current APS-C camera’s have to compete against FF sensors.

        • Mardock

          +1

          Exactly.

          No full-frame from Fuji for a very long time, if ever.

          Think about this logically for a moment. It would require an entirely new lineup of cameras … but more importantly, lenses. That’s a f*ck of a lot of R&D money and development. Fuji is already losing money on their existing X-Series lineup.

        • punku

          If he’s pointing out their current APS-C cameras, then he would have said something like “I’d like to challenge the professional market”.

      • Mike

        That’s a dig at the D300s and 7DII. K-3 surpasses those too.

  • Mardock

    Correction: Fuji did NOT say they’re going to compete in the full-frame market. They’ve only said it’s a possibility. Big difference.

    • Paul

      I guess i don’t understand the word, “Inevitably” then…

  • Shamael

    Will they put finally that crappy x-trans sensor in the trash and step back to the ancient super ccd sensor design. What makes Fuji cameras interesting is the design, what makes it a plague is their sensors, what makes it non of interest for many is the pricing. What performs best in their offer is there cheapest model with a simple Sony sensor. There is much to do at Fuji, starting with the prices. I remember the 3200$ for the S5 body when it cam out. 3 years later I bought mine when they stopped making them for 700$ new in the box. And, I still use it. Now, many will here scream because my critics on the sensors, but I just can tell you this, buy glasses and look closer. X-Trans sensor is a pain in the butt.

    • FreddyNogo

      Is this for real? I mean, is it true? I saw the dxomark test, over 400 iso it’s not acceptable.. Wonder so much, Fujisonyolymp….

    • X-proof

      +1. Of course they will go full frame. The X-series are a niche concept and they’ll take any opportunity in the market to fill a new niche. If a few thousand people want an X-camera in the format of a shoe, they will also make one. I’m not even joking, the X100 and X-Pro1 were an interesting concept, something where I could believe in, all the rest has only been released to get another few thousand of people buying into the system. And what system – that’s my question, it”s all indeed based on a very debatable sensor technology that caused more problems than it actually solved.

    • Clint

      I don’t have an issue with the Fuji pricing at all. Sure, if you bought an XPro1 the month it came out you overpaid but Fuji has had bundle offers (on and off) on most of their models for several years now. Besides…a 5D3 + 35mm 1.4L is much more money than an XT1 and 23mm.

      As for image quality…I’m happy with my XPro1….in most cases there isn’t much to choose between that and my 5D2.

  • Mabasa

    Xtrans with Nr and watercolor effect on it ns not a big deal even with Irident

  • stuey

    When Fuji make a high end FF camera,that’s when i think Fuji will take a big slice of the pro market,pro photographers are already standing by the edge of the pool,that’s when i think many will actually jump in.

    • lord eels

      yeah right. pros are married to systems. and fuji doesn’t even have a decent speed light yet.

      like everything else fuji, their FF system will be for annoying amateurs who value looking cool.

      • Andrzej Lukowiec

        And the question: what annoying “pro” could do with his pro Nikon, an amateur won’t be able to do… Apart from not so well focused pictures? 😉

        • lord eels

          if you don’t know the diff between a pro cam and an amateur cam, sorry it’s not my job to explain it to your ignorant self. you stinking 4-world euro-animal.

      • Clint

        Really?? ‘Pros’ change systems all the time….
        Besides, Canikon make MUCH more money off of the backs of rich amateur wannabes than actual ‘pros’,

        Trust me….if Fuji goes full frame they will sell lots of them.

        • mikeswitz

          He’s a rich troll. Don’t feed him.

        • lord eels

          fuji cannot viably produce a full frame camera. it would either cost way too much or ithey would go out of business. you need to realize fuji is a boutique company making toys for annoying people. THATs all they are good for.

  • rearranged

    What would Fuji offer you in these focal lengths that canon and Nikon aren’t offering you yet? When the lens allready weighs 3kg I don’t really see a light incospicious camera as an advantage….

    • BLFarnsworth

      What does Fuji offer that Nikon doesn’t? How about a listening ear? I would love to see someone here argue that Nikon listens to its customers (or the market).

      I’m anticipating crickets…

      BTW, I can’t comment on Canon & can only comment on what I own (Nikon)…

  • Graf Almassy

    Why everyone forcing the full frame format? Is the full frame format help you to be a better artist?

    Let’s see the current lens lineup:

    XF 23mm f/1.4 (35mm in FF)
    XF 35mm f/1.4 (50mm in FF)
    XF 56mm f/1.2 (85mm in FF)
    etc.. etc…

    Fujifilm is building 135 format “full frame” system in APS-C size! I don’t care about the sensor size in my camera. If I buy a Fujinon lens, I get the good old field of views and far enough depth of field.

    • Will

      Use A7 a few days w/55 1.8, then come back and repeat that.

      • BLFarnsworth

        I tried the A7 for a week, and I can’t say that the A7 w/the 55 f/1.8 lens was any better than a Fuji X-E2 when comparing 16×20 prints or even on a 55″ Sony 4K monitor.

        Admittedly the A7’s 24MP sensor might be better for the pixel-peepers out there.

      • BLFarnsworth

        Hmmm… 55mm f/1.8 for $1K USD? That price might be OK for an f/1.2 lens, but for this one — no thanks.

      • Graf Almassy

        Let me repeat myself:

        “I have Canon EOS 5D Mark III with lot of L-series lenses but that gear is too big, heavy and uncomfortable for traveling and street photography.
        The X-E2 (with XF23mm (eq. 35mm) and XF35mm (eq. 50mm)) is my secondary gear and love that camera! I’m not pixel peeper, but this X-Trans II sensor is very close to the bigger 5Dmk3 Full Frame sensor in low light performance, dinamic range and skin tone reproduction. Just check out the DxO, Dpreview and other comparisations if You are a pixel peeper.

        With this superb XF lenses I have the traditional 135 format FOVs and almost the same DOF at lower price.

        And oh…

        Canon EOS 5D Mark III body – 3399 USD
        Fujifilm X-E2 body – 999 USD

        What is your point?”

    • fjfjjj

      Ansel Adams should have shot 35mm.

      • mikeswitz

        Film does not equal digital. Who knows what Ansel Adams would have shot given todays technology? 8×10 digital sensor? Adams also did a fair amount of street photography in LA and D.C. with what I assume was 35mm.

        • guest

          I’ve seen pictures of him with a Hassy.

          • mikeswitz

            Was it a Stellar or Lunar?

          • Sky

            Retard, out.

    • Graf Unhappy With Small Sensor

      If you don’t know why larger sensor are better, you don’t need to ask – even less to make pointless statements.
      Larger sensor are better – your smaller thing is worse – you are envious. They are not unpayable you know?

      • Graf Almassy

        I have Canon EOS 5D Mark III with lot of L-series lenses but that gear is too big, heavy and uncomfortable for traveling and street photography.

        The X-E2 (with XF23mm (eq. 35mm) and XF35mm (eq. 50mm)) is my secondary gear and love that camera! I’m not pixel peeper, but this X-Trans II sensor is very close to the bigger 5Dmk3 Full Frame sensor in low light performance, dinamic range and skin tone reproduction. Just check out the DxO, Dpreview and other comparisations if You are a pixel peeper.

        With this superb XF lenses I have the traditional 135 format FOVs and almost the same DOF at lower price.

        And oh…

        Canon EOS 5D Mark III body – 3399 USD
        Fujifilm X-E2 body – 999 USD

        What is your point?

        • LOL

          > Just check out the DxO
          DxO doesn’t test xtrans. And it is well known fuji overestimate their iso ratings. In reality, there’s practically no difference between it and bayer. The fact DxO doesn’t support xtrans also makes bayer a better high iso performer: currently best NR is PRIME from DxO Optics 9, xtrans just can’t touch this level of performance.

          • Jim d

            some say they over estimate their iso ratings however the low light operation of the x series cameras speak for themselves . You can call it iso 6400 or 12800 , whatever you want , if the sensor -processor combination delievers low noise / low light images the point is moot. the sensor is clearly not the same as a Bayer . There are MANY images on the net shot with 16mp x-trans that stand up side by side all day long with full frame sensor images from Canon, Nikon, Sony. Take a look at some of Zack A’s images , the Marrakech shot with the guy and his monkey is amazing.

          • LOL

            Please, don’t be a retard. Here’s an example of X-E1 vs Nikon D7100 properly done comparison: the guy equalize shutter speed and saturation, not ISO value. http://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/51722293

            Nikon downscaled to 16Mp. It is clearly better than Fuji. This difference will dramatically increase with DxO PRIME for Nikon.

  • Say What?

    I always like how transparent and honest Fuji is. No monkey business.

  • joe

    Everybody who’s now entering the FF-market shows that they back on the wrong horse – and always said that aps-c is the thing. I find it very funny, another mount and another lens series… pah ha!

  • Mike45450

    I believe they will test the full frame waters with the X100(s) successor. That is an entity of its own. It isn’t affected by any of the X-Mount lenses, and it is a standalone product, so they could easily release an X200 with full frame sensor. Like they say though, they want to wait until they are satisfied with the APS-C lenses before progressing any further, so I think the full frame ILC is still a while off.

  • Global

    The only additional “Win” that I could see Fujifilm making is if they copied a page out of Nikon’s strategy and made a 16mp, and a 24mp-or-36mp strategy.

    – ISO Maximizer,
    – MP Maximizer.

    Leaving one of these out always alienates people on the other end of the spectrum. Also, Fujifilm should invest heavily in ISO technologies, if they are going Full Frame. The only reason people are USING Fujifilms is to get away from the heaviness of full frame. So if Fuji goes that way, but doesn’t have the same ISO, then there is really no point whatsoever to using Fuji over Canon or Nikon. On the other hand, if Fuji can set itself apart with extreme ISO, keeping prices lower than Nikon or Canon at the same ISO, then it has a chance in the full frame market.

    And while 16mp is enough for most applications, Fuji needs to have an offering for studio and landscape work at higher resolutions to remain competitive. I don’t think they can do another generation of 16mp and get away with it, unless they dramatically boost ISO & also simultaneously introduce a plan for a high-MP camera. It just starts to feel like when all of Nikons offerings were 12mp; consumers get a stale feeling, even when each camera had indeed progressed.

    • Global

      By the way, I wasn’t suggestion Fuji should go full frame — i was suggesting the opposite. They should make 2 “Art” lines of Cropped cameras, one that is high ISO, and a second that is high MP. Nikon has proved this is a winning strategy. But other brands have yet to properly adopt it. If Fuji can make very clear art tools out of its cameras — rather than being a “mushy middle 16mp”, then it can strengthen its brand.

      I think manufacturers make huge mistakes when they say “this is the best of everything” because what it means is “this is a compromise of everything.” They should go squarely for ISO or go squarely for MP. Meanwhile, Fuji really needs to enhance some of its speed issues (synch speed and etc). Its lagging behind in those.

      If Fuji ever does start with Fullframe, I think it definitely would be a fixed lens camera, they way it started with the X lines basically.

  • Paul

    I will probably be in the market for a FF compact in about 5 years (when I get bored of my d600) and whoever has the best FF compact at the time will get my money. right now, it is really only Sony with an option (r7). I hope that better competition will give me several options.

  • I think there is some misunderstanding here. Fuji will consider bigger sensors once they complete their APS-C lens line-up. This is very clearly said at the end of the interview. So they may consider it sometimes in 2016 or later 😉

    There is another part that could be misunderstood, however:

    “Do you you want to compete against professional full-frame cameras?

    Inevitably yes, we have to compete against full-frame. The professional market is very segmented, and for example for sports photography I think the X-T1 is already competitive. So yes, I’d like to challenge full-frame.”

    This clearly applies to their current APS-C line-up. Further improvements in AF-C performance, the upcoming fast constant zooms (and the mystery telephoto) may provide a light-weight alternative to current full frame systems, even for sports, especially with the good low-light performance of their sensors.

    And they are competing against the SONY A7/A7r line as well. I’m considering both SONY and FUJI as a replacement for my backup camera (d7000). I need something more portable, smaller, with good lenses for my personal projects or location scouting, even some types of work (my main camera is the d800 which I don’t intend to replace in the next 3-4 years). Looks like Fuji’s gonna be the winner, thanks to their excellent lens line-up. This lens line-up is part of their strategy of competing against full frame.

    Take the A7 + 35mm F/2.8 Zeiss for example. $2500. Fuji X-T1 + 23mm F/1.4 $2300. Now most coach photographers would think the bigger sensor wins, but in practice, and in this case, it doesn’t. These combinations basically have the same FoV, but you can use two stops lower ISO (or faster shutter speed) on the Fuji combo. For instance, where I would need to use ISO 12800 on the Sony A7, I could use ISO 3200 on the Fuji. Add to this the deeper lens line-up and the inevitable size advantage (the 70-200 F/4 lens for Sony will be larger and heavier than the the Fuji equivalent) and you can see how Fuji could compete against FF successfully with their APS-C line-up. Smart people, those Fuji guys.

    • With the current rebates, Csaba, you should be able to get that Fuji combo for a couple hundred bucks cheaper than that.

      • I wish! Unfortunately, no rebates in SE-Asia :-/

  • Back to top